The Houston Texans visit the Baltimore Ravens this afternoon in the AFC divisional round of the 2012 NFL playoffs. The Ravens are favored to win the game.
The New England Patriots beat the Denver Broncos on Saturday so the winner of this will play in New England next weekend.
I'm taking the Ravens. Who are you taking?
0 recs | 515 comments
Texans, baby!
ArrowSpread - January 15, 2012
The Ravens can win all they want
Just not by 8 :-)
Steve_in_RI - January 15, 2012
Texans
Just because I’m a huge Arian Foster fan..the guys awesome
Rac_City29 - January 15, 2012
and proof you don't need to take RB's in the first round
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Don't need to draft them at all, apparently.
ArrowSpread - January 15, 2012
Yates
Rooting for him. To bad he doesn’t openly flaunt his beliefs, or the guy could have had a whole week of disappointing buildup. I’ll say Ravens by 9.
BucktheFroncos - January 15, 2012
No way the Ravens cover.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
probably not
just thought i would try and Jonah Steve’s line :)
BucktheFroncos - January 15, 2012
I also picked the Texans in the preseason to go to the Super Bowl.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Deirdorf looks like a Shar Pei
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
He
and Fouts are my absolute least favorite announcers for Chiefs games.
BucktheFroncos - January 15, 2012
I don't mind Dierdorf.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Do you mind nails on a chalkboard?
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
that statement makes my ears cringe
LadyChief - January 15, 2012
Now you know how I feel about Dierdork.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
More than Aikman?
LadyChief - January 15, 2012
The worst is Joe Buck...
How that asshole has that job, but doesn’t understand the difference between an end around and a reverse is beyond me.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
his dad?
LadyChief - January 15, 2012
But his dad didn't call football games...
Joe Buck is much less bad during baseball games.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I guess Jack did call some football too
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I couldn't remember
LadyChief - January 15, 2012
That applies to about 95% of announcers.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Its one of my biggest pet peeves
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
That
and the confusion between pass interference, illegal contact and defensive holding.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
That doesn't bother me as much...
I also hate it when a replay is shown a hundred times and announcers spend too much time looking at the feet to not see a knee was down.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Please don't make me choose.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
You have too!
LadyChief - January 15, 2012
many options?
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Tebow thinks so
LadyChief - January 15, 2012
Not enough for him.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
maybe that is why he looks confused
LadyChief - January 15, 2012
And sounds like a dork.
Hence, Dierdork.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
sounds like the name of an elf
LadyChief - January 15, 2012
Setting the tone.
ArrowSpread - January 15, 2012
It's strange that you don't see more FB dives in short yardage situations.
It’s a quick handoff to a big guy that already has a couple steps of steam. Just makes sense.
ArrowSpread - January 15, 2012
I don't know why more teams don't run those off guard instead of over center...
Or do what you said out of the offset I
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Ravens are inconsistent.
But they’re as good as any team in the AFC when they come to play. And they should come to play this week. This is the week were the Texans really miss their starting QB.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
I don't trust the Ravens offense at all... Or this guy.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
For a long stretch of games, I agree.
But for one game, when they’re very focused, I do.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Meh...
inconsistency doesn’t care about the situation. It rears its head randomly.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
you don't trust Ernie?
what’d he ever do to break your trust in him!
fongKC - January 15, 2012
He stole my Rubber duckie when I was a kid thats me though
PSUkegreen - January 15, 2012
epic fail
fongKC - January 15, 2012
lol Kris Wilson td
Bleedzredngold - January 15, 2012
Secret weapon!
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Kris Wilson ?
our Kris Wilson
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
yup
Bleedzredngold - January 15, 2012
Damn all those guys we missed on, turn out
fabulousSteve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
I thought Kris Wilson would have been much better than he was...
I wonder if playing behind Tony G for so long just stunted his development.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Yeah kind of like Brad Cottam.
KcChiefsMo - January 15, 2012
I never had high expectations for him.
Kris Wilson was such an athletic freak coming out of college.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Is he the "original" Hybrid?
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Tony Gonzalez?
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Wilson
H-Back
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Id give that nod to Kleinsasser
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Fridge Perry?
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
I wouldn't say that considering it was his first catch of the entire season...
KcChiefsMo - January 15, 2012
you just don't get itaveragegatsby - January 15, 2012
Like I said...
Secret weapon!
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
How'd they manage to keep a lid on that for 17 weeks is beyond me.
You’d think Pioli was running the Ravens franchise.
ArrowSpread - January 15, 2012
They think that far in advance.
How epic would a Ravens 49ers rematch be in the Super Bowl.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
would anybody score?
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
oh you meant brothers
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Who has more TD's this week, Kris Wilson or Gronkowski?
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Grono had two yesterday i might be wrong
PSUkegreen - January 15, 2012
he had 3
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
How many did TG have?
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Flacco is looking
EliteSteve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Flacco reminds me of Kyle Boller but a little bit better.
PSUkegreen - January 15, 2012
Tom Brady vs Alex Smith would be an awesome Matchup
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
How can a show be "A New Hit Comedy" after one episode?
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
emphasis on NEW
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
I watched about half of Rob... and it was about as bad as all his shitty movies.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Bring back Rob Petrie
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
They did ........
he is on ME TV
LadyChief - January 15, 2012
Laura Petrie: Rob, you’re not well.
Robert ‘Rob’ Petrie: Laurie, I’m perfectly all right.
Laura Petrie: Really? Then how come you can’t out-wrestle a 112-pound woman?
Robert ‘Rob’ Petrie: Because I’m not really trying, that’s why.
Laura Petrie: [pinning him down] Try.
Robert ‘Rob’ Petrie: All right, you want to play around? Okay.
[tries to get up, but Laurie keeps him pinned down]
Robert ‘Rob’ Petrie: Okay, Gorgeous George, knock it off. All right, so you’re stronger than me; what does that prove?
Laura Petrie: It proves you’re sick.
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
hmm good article on Flynn and Packers on PFT
Chiefs need to give up a 4th round pick and work out a sign/trade deal for Flynn!
fongKC - January 15, 2012
Won't he be a FA so unless Packers franchise him, they can't trade him
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
from the article
fongKC - January 15, 2012
I believe thats called tampering
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
The Packers would be tampering with their own guy?
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
they are sneaky that way
LadyChief - January 15, 2012
That's why they always win
except against the Chiefs.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
lol!
LadyChief - January 15, 2012
I misread it.
But it doesn’t make any sense. For one why would Flynn do this? And two if a team is that desperate why would they sign him and give up a draft pick, when they could just sign him.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
if they work out a deal before he goes to FA
they don’t have to worry about him signing with another team.
but I agree, I don’t know why Flynn would agree to it instead of just seeing what he’s worth in the open market.
fongKC - January 15, 2012
But it comes down to giving up money and picks.
In the long run its cheaper to just give up the money
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I would imagine...
it comes down to about a 4 or 5 team bidding war, and I doubt that any of them are that good, so its probably going to just come down to money.
With the slot system on the draft now, draft picks are more valuable than ever.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Dan Snyder vs himself
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
I have no idea why Flynn would do that.
Doesn’t make any sense to me either. I think his signing bonus would count against the Packers too, which makes it less likely they’d want to.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
It all depends on how the signing bonus was drafted...
you could change it to a roster bonus, all kinds of clever wording that could change how the bonus is applied.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
thought it was only tampering
if you contacted a player under contract, not a team
fongKC - January 15, 2012
Hottest?
When did they write that about Orton?
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
neck beards aren't hot?
LadyChief - January 15, 2012
Mine IS :)
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
I guess I don't understand the NFL FA rules... in that scenario, Chiefs should be able to trade Carr even though he's a FA too. I'll have to go read the article
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
If I were Flynn, I would know I could make more money on the open market as a FA so I wouldn't sign a deal with GB at less money
just so they could get a mid-rd draft pick and trade me somewhere
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
They cant trade Flynn
and we cant trade Carr unless they are franchised tagged and signed deal. Without that they both go wherever they want to go.
Bilk - January 15, 2012
the point was...
that GB would resign Flynn then trade him… Which is very unlikely
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I agree, Shefter stated they were unlikely to frachise him anyway
Bilk - January 15, 2012
SO who is the new Backup GB QB?
wouldn’t it make more sense to re-sign him?
Are we going to talk about the Houston Texans during the GB game?
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Why would it make sense to resign him?
He’s going to demand starter money based on his small sample, and he will get it because a team will pay it.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
so
Flynn
Orton
Campbell
…
all are going to be starters somewhere in the nfl
along with
Luck
Manning
and
RGIII
?
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
I doubt all those guys will be starters.
I still think Indy keeps Peyton and drafts Luck… And I also doubt Campbell will be a starter next year.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
He might be a better option for at least two teams in the AFC West
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
You think
Indy will have over $50M tied up in QBs next year?
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
does anyone on that team deserve the money more?
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
That's not the point.
The worst team in the NFL cannot afford to tie up that much money in one position.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
If Manning bounces back they won't be the worst team in the NFL
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Well
I assume their goal is more lofty than just not being the worst team in the NFL.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
But the logic is (not that I agree with it)
Before Manning went down they were a Super Bowl contender, without Manning they are a terrible team, when Manning comes back they will be a Super Bowl contender again.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I think it's obvious now
that they’re not a legitimate Super Bowl contender, even with Manning. He helped mask some of their problems that are now painfully obvious. And I think cutting ties with Polian indicates they’re ready for a fresh start, and not satisfied with false hope.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Irsay doesn't strike me as the most rational owner
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I'll have to agree with you.............
AGAIN
LadyChief - January 15, 2012
Agreed.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
I wish the Chiefs would tie up 50 Million in QB money
not to Manning though
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Careless Whispers
to
Drew Brees Agent might get a Deal done :)
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
I'm sure he'd take a $50M signing bonus.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
For one year?
Who do you think the Chiefs should spend $50M on next year?
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Tebow
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Sure
but he’s not a free agent.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
This...
Its an investment. They can get more for Manning if he proves he is healthy. And if Manning comes back and they don’t miss a beat, then who cares.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
But why pay him 35 Million for one season.
Because you aren’t going to sit Luck for two years are you?
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
How is Manning going to make 35 million?
And how will Luck make 15 million in his first year?
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
he has close to 30 million in roster bonus due
mid March
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Manning is due a $28M roster bonus.
That’s in addition to his yearly salary.
Cam Newton received a $14,518,000 signing bonus last year. Certainly Luck will get more than that.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Signing bonus is spread out over 4 years
His cap number is 4 million this year
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Cam Newton that is
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
It's spread out over the cap.
That doesn’t mean the money paid is spread out over the life of the contract. Otherwise, what would be the point of not just making it salary?
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
because its still guaranteed
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
You can guarantee salary too.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
I don't think that is true
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Cam Newton's entire contract is guaranteed.
Not just the signing bonus he received.
Link
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
by those numbers
Cam Newton is making 4 million, not 15.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Did you miss the signing bonus?
We’re talking about what Luck will make in 2012.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
the signing bonus is the bulk of his contract this year
His salary is 375K, and his signing bonus for this year is 3.6 million.
Luck won’t make much more than Newton did, the slotting system won’t let it get out of hand.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Luck will make about $17M
and Peyton will make about $35M. Hence, “do you think the Colts will tie up about $50M in one position this year?”
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Luck will not make 17 million year one.
Teams do not pay all the singing bonus in one year.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Yes they do.
Again, why do you think they even have a signing bonus? I already demonstrated that all of Cam’s contract is guaranteed. So why split some of it off as a signing bonus?
You’re confusing cap hit, which IS spread out over the life of the contract, vs. when the money actually changes hands.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
But its not...
the link you sent me clearly shows its split over 4 years.
I don’t know why it is the case with the Newton contract since apparently his whole contract is guaranteed, probably because its not that much considering he’s the first pick.
But that signing bonus is spread out over 4 years. Its clear as day on that link YOU posted.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Cap hit
is a reflection of what the player makes that year. Why would the NFL allow the cap hit to be spread out if they are going to spend all the money initially.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Bonuses are never spread out.
Or they wouldn’t be bonuses. Lucks signing bonus is like Mannings roster bonus. It’s paid upfront.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
I imagine that came from the players.
It benefits them to get more money up front.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Here you can see
Link
Bradfords wasn’t
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Bradfords signing bonus was paid year two.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
exactly
his wasn’t spread out, which is why the Rams took the hit in year two
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Which means at the start of the league year in year two of his contract he was paid 17.9M$ upfront
Then received his salary cheques every week over the course of the season.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
right...
And it shows that on his contract information… But Cam Newtons is spread out over 4 years, like it shows on his contract information
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Cam Newton got a 14M$ signing bonus upfront
But as far as cap hit it’s spread out over the life of the contract. You can’t really compare Newtons last year to anything done before because with the new CBA these contracts are going to be set up differently. In cash though he was still paid that bonus up front.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
This is fucking ridiculous
why would the NFL allow the money to be spread out if, the money was paid now?
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
It's called a contract.
Some things are put in to benefit the players. Not everything in the CBA is for the owners’ benefit.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Oh its called a contract?
So spreading a singing bonus out over 4 years wouldn’t be to the teams benefit?
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
So you're saying it benefits both sides.
And yet you’re asking why they would allow it?
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
the argument works both ways
it also benefits to pay it out over 4 years
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
That would certainly benefit owners.
Not so much the players, who benefit by receiving more money up front. As I said.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
but the money is still
guaranteed, where the contracts are not. Which benefits the players also
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
You forget.
The players fought hard against having a salary cap at all. Obviously the owners had to throw them some bones in order to get a deal done. They weren’t going to be able to just implement an all pro-owner salary cap.
http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2012/1/15/2709088/texans-vs-ravens-2012#88787751
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
I didn't forget
I don’t see how it applies.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
That's the breakdown of the cap hit.
Okay, explain to me why there is any such thing as a signing bonus, if it’s all spread out just like salary.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Because not all salarys
are guaranteed.
But the singing bonus are.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I give up.
CAM NEWTON’S ENTIRE CONTRACT IS GUARANTEED.
SAM BRADFORD GOT $50M GUARANTEED. IT WASN’T ALL IN A SIGNING BONUS.
WOW!
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Im not arguing this.
Im arguing that it is spread out. Because it clearly is.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
One last time and then I'm done.
Since all of Cam Newton’s contract is guaranteed, why is some of it called signing bonus and some of it called base salary? Keeping mind that any or all of base salary can be guaranteed. (And is, in this case.)
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
All of his contract is guaranteed
because its only 22 million. It could be for some reason if Newton is cut so they can defer some of it later, and pay some of it now. I really don’t know, and I doubt you do either.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Actually, I do.
Look at the bottom of the comments. The signing bonus is paid in a lump sum, as I said.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
It doesnt really matter what the cap hit is.
They’re still forking over 15+2-3M for him next year.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Exactly.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Manning has a 28M$ bonus being paid at the start of the league year + 7.5 in salary for the season.
Last year Cam Newtons signing bonus was 14.5M plus his couple million in salary. And if you’re trying to prove that Manning is healthy so you can trade him next year you might get what? One 1st for him? Or you cut him now, save 35M$ and get a 3rd rounder for him next year for comp pick.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
If Manning his healthy he brings back more than one 1st
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Not a chance.
Especially when the whole league knows you have to trade him. By then a 37 year old QB who has a serious injury history now with his neck being traded by a team who HAS to get rid of him won’t draw much more then a 1st rounder.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
You underestimate the stupidity of some teams...
And I don’t see why Manning wouldn’t be open to renegotiating his contract, he didn’t want all that money in the first place.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
What benefit is it to him to renegotiate?
So he gets one more year with the Colts? He knows they arent going to sit Luck for more then one season so he would be out the season after anyway. If Polian was there then maybe but I doubt it now. Also that team, even with him, might not even be a playoff contender. He wants to win. That team isn’t winning anything next year even with him.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Because if he is trying to prove his worth...
his best chance at proving it might be with the Colts. He isn’t going to be able to go to a new team and have the same system, or freedom he has in Indy.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
So he proves his worth next year with the Colts
Then gets traded to a team that he has no say in and costs his new team a pick or multipe picks? That doesn’t seem to be worth it.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
I don't think the Colts would do that to him
At this point, its not like Peyton would care if a team is going to mortgage the future to win now.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
The only guy who had allegiance to him is out of the building now.
I’ll be shocked if he isnt released before the start of the league year. The only alternative I can see is if he agrees to renegotiate his contract in exchange for being traded to a team he approves of this offseason. And considering we supposedly looked into trading for him last offseason we still might be in the mix in a trade scenario this year.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Irsay doesn't have allegiance to Peyton
If it wasn’t for Peyton, that team wouldn’t have gotten a new stadium and would have been moved to LA.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Irsay is a business man
I don’t think he has any allegiance to him. Alot of what you just said is in past tense which is how Irsay will look at it too.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
That organization
owes everything it has to Peyton, and they aren’t going to fuck him because of it.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I think you underestimate what business people will to in the name of "business decisions".
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
do*
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
We are talking about the same
guy who forced Peyton to take more money
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
That was Polian.
Trying to protect the paper legacy that Peyton was propping up.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
So you think Indy is going to pay 50M$ to thei QBs next year?
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
It takes two to tango.
I imagine he wants to start, and wants to get starter money. And he probably will.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
I hate backup qbs that think they can start
PSUkegreen - January 15, 2012
Ahhhh
Now we are talking!
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Yeah what the hell was that Steve Young asshole thinking
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
There is a case for a few but steve young was brought in to replace Montana
PSUkegreen - January 15, 2012
Aaron Rodgers too
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
So you like backup QBs
who lack confidence and a competitive will?
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Dammit Tarkus
Don’t go putting words in peoples Mouths
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Huh?
He said he hates backups who think they can start. Every QB in the NFL should have that attitude. If not, they either lack confidence in themselves, or they lack a competitive spirit.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Moneyball taught me that if they have ugly girlfriends they lack confidence
So Brodie Croyle should be a starter
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
yeah. The story is poising the ridiculous idea that GB would sign Flynn to a multi-year deal and then trade him, which makes no sense
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
Refs should throw a flag
on Flaccos foo man choo
KCinAZ - January 15, 2012
What a terrible read by Yates.
ArrowSpread - January 15, 2012
When does the "Good" game start?
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Is Delhomme going to make an appearance this game?
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
Great blitx pick up there
KCinAZ - January 15, 2012
Arrowhead!!!
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Need a Ben Tate sighting
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
Wow, Yates waaay telegraphed that one.
Lucky it wasn’t picked.
TRSChief - January 15, 2012
Pollard strikes
Damn another one that
got awaySteve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Pollard still playing yep just gave up a big play
PSUkegreen - January 15, 2012
Yea I dont miss that and missed tackles
Bilk - January 15, 2012
The Houston Center is a Free Agent
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Free Hudson!
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Already?
You’d think that would happen in the off season
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
If Pioli has't been able to get either Carr or Bowe signed by this point I doubt he overpays for a FA lineman
He’ll go for a Mike Goff type instead
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
thank gawd there is only ONE Mike Goff
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Myers will more then likely be back in Houston
They would be dumb to let him go. If the Chiefs don’t like Hudson at center moving forward then a guy that I would like to see brought in(alot cheaper then Myers) is Scott Wells from GB.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
I think they need to play Hudon at C next year to prove he can't handle it before bringing in a FA to bury him on the depth chart
I think he can handle the job
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
Flacco
God dang he’s one funny looking dude.
Jordan w - January 15, 2012 via mobile
Nice lil hold, there.
ArrowSpread - January 15, 2012
What a strange, Haleyesque challenge.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
more air time for Pollard
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
And people were actually mad we let this guy walk?
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Houston is a feast or famine running offense
they either get huge chunks of yards or nothing
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Great grab from foster
PSUkegreen - January 15, 2012
That was a hell of a catch
EricBerryYoYouScary - January 15, 2012
Foster aint going quietly
KCinAZ - January 15, 2012
Damn that Goal line must be bullet-proof
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Anyone know if RB#3 Derrick Ward for Texans is a FA this off season?
He’d be a good complement to Charles
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
Free agent but 31 years old.
I’ve always liked him as a depth back but he’s hitting that age where things go south.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
yeah, but not much wear on the tires the past two years. Ronnie Brown is another guy that had a season to heal up this year
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
True enough
Only about 200 carries total over the last 3 seasons.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Anyone notice how Terrance Cody's been playing? I've been watching the Texans offence when they'd had the balll to this point
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
money catch
EricBerryYoYouScary - January 15, 2012
Anyone else want to see a niners-ravens Super Bowl?
Two of the best defences in the game, plus it’s two brothers coaching against each other in the Super Bowl.
SirBenGartland - January 15, 2012
Would be about as boring as the BCS Championship
I don’t see how the Niners make it though. If it wasn’t for the Saints shooting themselves in the foot early, the Saints would’ve run away with the game.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Jamaal Charles...
got 82 yards with 9 carries against the baltimore D. If it wasn’t for Matt Cassel, he probably would have had broken 150 yards with 10 more carries. I am very excited to see Charles run over every team we play next year as he always does.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Watt is beastin
ArrowSpread - January 15, 2012
Yeah
a guy like Watt would elevate our D to another level with berry and siler also coming back.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Man, Watt would look nice opposite TJax.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Yup, dude gets upfield fast.
But that’s the Phillips 3-4… I don’t see him eating up double teams.
ArrowSpread - January 15, 2012
Dorsey isn't asked to eat up double teams much in our D either.
Crennel uses him more as a one gap guy on that side, although that may be because he knows he can’t stand up to double teams all day so he’s adjusted to play to Glenns strengths.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Didn't see that double team on that Dickson play right now?
ChiefWarPaint - January 15, 2012
Yeah
With Houston and Hali coming off the edges, the Oline would need to be perfect against our D…
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Yeah, I think it's time to move Dorsey for whatever pioli can get in return and plug in a bigger (taller) DE opposite TJax
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
Now would be the time to do it with Brockers declaring.
Or maybe Allen Bailey can be that guy. He started to really come around late in the year. You would think there would be some interest in Dorsey from 4-3 teams and he’s probably still worth a midrounder.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Would love to see
Bailey get more snaps. Hate to think that trading Dorsey to a 4-3 will allow him to have a greater effect than he ever had with us, but I guess it would be a win win scenario.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Why not just keepDorsey for the final year
ChiefWarPaint - January 15, 2012
how do u feel about T jack
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
Because he isn't worth anything to us next year
If we can get a 4th rounder for him now then we at least get something. Of course I guess you could hope he walks and really has an amazing season with his name and get a 3rd round comp pick but I would rather have a 4th now.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
I think the Chiefs would be a better team with him this year
than a 3-4 round pick.
then we can decide to sign or franchise him
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
We have Bailey and can re-sign Gordon who was very good in spot duty this year.
I don’t think we’re that much better this year with him and it would come at a cost of getting a younger, more appropriate player at that position getting snaps.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
and spend our 1st round pick on that?
CMON MAN
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
You really don't need to replace him with anything more then Bailey and Gordon if you dont want to.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
and get totally run over by Denver and Oakland
Pitt Baltimore and Cleveland with Trent Richardson
no thanks
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
a 3rd round pick is not worth losing 7 games next year
on a Bailey and a prayer
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
If we're losing 7 games next year then we have more problems then just DE.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Your trade would create more problems than benefit
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
How so?
We would trade a player at a position that we can afford to lose, gain a draft pick to get a player to develop in another position of need and save about 4.5M$.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
I would be perfectly comfortable with Gordon over Dorsey going into next year.
You could make a very good argument that Gordon > Dorsey this year.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
is gordon signed for 2012
I don’t think so
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Do you really think there will be a huge market for him?
I think that’s an easy re-sign.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
How can you make this claim?
Gordon didn’t nearly have the same snaps as Dorsey.
ChiefWarPaint - January 15, 2012
I dont think
we are going to get run over by anyone next year.
Add Berry and Siler to our D which has already shown great potential and a possibility to be a top 3 Defense next year.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Proven play over we Hope is not a good plan Guys
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
dorsey had a good year this year
stat wise
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
I don't like stats.
I like what I see with my eyes and this year he was hot and cold and got absolutely no pressure on the QB. In his only start in place of Dorsey, Gordon had a better game then Dorsey put up all year.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
I don't like football stats
because they are inconclusive
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Football stats are worthless without context.
When you put the two together they make sense but honestly football isn’t baseball.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
So I guess Dorsey is better than anyone else
since he played more damn snaps than anyone else for the Chiefs at 3-4 DE
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Last year he did
That wasn’t the case this year. I think your way overvalueing Dorsey here. Where’s Kalo when I need 2 cents.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
I repeat he played more 3-4 DE snaps than anyone else
of course I meant Chiefs players
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
I don't think you can say that Gilbeery or Bailey would have had twice the stats if they playd as many snaps as Dorsey
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
You are undervaluing his contribution to our team
Run stopper
and Hali and DJ are both Pro-Bowlers cause of Dorsey
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
yep
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
I mean some football stats will tell you basic things
but the only stats I put a lot of faith in are football outsiders DVOA and DYAR, and I can’t calculate those so they don’t interest me as much.
Im also not sold on QBR
There are mainstream baseball stats that are far more useless than any football stat…
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I think the value we get out of him starting
And allowing our young guys to continue developing>4th round pick
ChiefWarPaint - January 15, 2012
What would be the point? I'd rather upgrade his position this year than keep Dorsey around for the last year of his contract to just too watch him walk next year with no compensation
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
we have lots of positions that need upgraded first
Weigmann
Lilja
Richardson
NT
maybe CB and or WR
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
so you'd rather keep a player that's going to be gone next year, rather than trade him this year for a 4th rd pick?
that pick could in turn be used for one of the needs you listed above.
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
The cost is lost games
We are trying to WIN games not the Draft
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
b rich and weigs are the big ones
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
Weigs is replaced by Hudson so just need to draft a RT
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
You Hope
no guarantees that Hudson is better
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
To continue to allow our young guys to develop
Bailey isn’t ready and one start from Gordon does not a player make. If we drafted Brockers in the first I’d rather we let him sit a year too, he’s only 21 and growing into his body.
ChiefWarPaint - January 15, 2012
who cares
He would be disruptive in kc defense better than dorsey or tjack ever has btw tjack gates is better than Cassel too
rickrock58 - January 15, 2012
Watt should have went top 10
Seriously such a damn good player.
ChiefWarPaint - January 15, 2012
tj yates i mean
rickrock58 - January 15, 2012
First time commenting
Off topic of the game. I would like manning here not as a qb but as a QB coach. He is young enough to put the pads on and show what to do and what to look for etc. instead of pictures and films alone. Thoughts about that
kniteeagle67 - January 15, 2012 via mobile
Would
love to see us drafting Kellen Moore and have him work under Manning.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
NFL Salary Cap
Link
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
This should end the conversation.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Why do I think it won't?
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Because this is still AP right?
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
I have so many more questions and counterpoints
but they’ve all been said before, so I don’t see the point in rehashing them.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
maybe you could explain MLB rules?
that should take a week or so
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Just turned the game on
and it’s cutting out every 5 seconds. Boo Cox.
independent739 - January 15, 2012
do u think there is any chance brees becomes a free agent
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
zero
joplin chiefs fan - January 15, 2012
optimist
independent739 - January 15, 2012
Is there a number less then zero?
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Negative Zero?
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
square root of zero.
independent739 - January 15, 2012
Infinity and Beyond
works both ways
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Is there a number less than zero that isn't negative I can use?
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
u don't think brees wants to atleast listen to what teams might offer him.
kinda like what bowe and carr might do
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
Not a chance.
Have you read that KC Start article? KC has nothing to offer.
independent739 - January 15, 2012
Star**
(sorry, cable cutting out is throwing me off my game)
independent739 - January 15, 2012
nope
joplin chiefs fan - January 15, 2012
He might want to listen
But he won’t get a chance to. Franchisetagville for Brees.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
I don't think it takes that long
I imagine a deal gets done before they have to Franchise him.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
if they tag brees would u still trade for him 2 first rd picks
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
I would.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
without hesitation
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Sadly, Pioli wouldn't...
independent739 - January 15, 2012
And then sign him to a 7 year 100M$+ deal.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
of course
and it will be spread over 7 years, cept that 1st part :)
Tag AG your it
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
What could another team possibly offer him to make him think about moving?
He is a god in that town.
He has a great coach.
He leads an offense that just helped him break the all-time passing record for a QB
Do you really think another team could even hope to lure him away by offering him 18 million instead of 15?
joplin chiefs fan - January 15, 2012
if it was a right situation and a huge amount of dough some off the wall contract that the saints can't match i say yes he would consider it big time
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
I don't think there is a "righter" situation though
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
This ^
He is just as likely to win more Super Bowls with the Saints as he is anyone else.
joplin chiefs fan - January 15, 2012
A defense?
and possibly more SB rings
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
This is true
Brees with the Chiefs D and with all of Chiefs offensive skilled position players?
Chance for multiple championships and a dynasty.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
the Chiefs don't have Graham
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Chiefs
have Charles, the best RB in the league, Bowe, Breaston, Baldwin, Moeaki, McClain, McCluster, and Battle.
Brees can work well with those players.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Charles and Moeaki are far from sure things...
Baldwin has done nothing, McClain doesn’t have a purpose in a Brees offense, Battle isn’t that good.
McCluster could be dangerous with Brees, Bowe might not be back, and Breaston is getting old
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
You are a Royal Fan :)
Such Negativity
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
I have more faith in the Royals future than the Chiefs
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
whereas the Roylas need 3 Standout Pitchers
the Chiefs need Just One
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
yeah, but the Royals have more offensive firepower than the Chiefs
Plus potential in starting pitching, where as the Chiefs know exactly what they have in “pitching”
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
This
is truly delusional. There is no way Royals are going to win a championship any time soon. They cannot beat the Rays, Yankees, Rangers, Tigers, Angels or the Red Sox in a playoff series. The Yanks and Red Sox are going to keep spending so it doesnt really matter if they get old, and Rays are always going to have better younger players infused with timely veteran hitting because of Joe Maddon and Andrew Friedman. Not to mention the Rangers and Angels are getting better and better.
All the Chiefs need is a QB to become a great team in the NFL.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
the funny thing is...
They won’t have to beat the Rays, Yankees, Ragners, Tigers, Angels and the Red Sox in a playoff series.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Disagree
just because Brees plays a certain style with the saints, doesnt mean he can’t play in any other type of offense.
Saying Charles is nothing from a sure thing is tremendously undervaluing the guy, and great QBs are going to get the ball into the WR’s hands. With the WR we have and the mismatches we can create, Brees would break 400 yards passing every game if he wanted to.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
you are very dillusional
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Dont see how im delusional
Breaston was a great WR for the Cardinals when they had a good QB.
Bowe we all know is a huge offensive threat. Baldwin has showed alot of potential this year and most of his problems seem to be tied to his lack of focus and timing. I would put money that he makes big strides for next year. Moeaki also showed great talent his first year and was very sure handed his first season, not to mention he had the greatest catch in the regular season that year when Cassel overthrew him by a mile in the endzone.
Charles’s rushing averages have been astronomically high since college, and I really dont see why you dont think JC is a sure thing. He singlehandedly carried Cassel to a 10-6 record and a playoff berth last season.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Thats the funny thing about delusional people...
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
rofl
youll be eating your words next season. Even Orton is going to be successful with Charles back.
You’ll see again the greatness of Jamaal Charles
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
what words were those exactly?
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
And
Steven Breaston is only 28 btw
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
You mean like the mismatches his team creates now?
independent739 - January 15, 2012
You mean
with one of the worst QBs in Cassel and definitely the worst QB in Palko? Dont understimate the importance of the QB
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
i was referring to Brees' current team... ?
independent739 - January 15, 2012
?
I am lost as always…
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Who Can't stop Alex Smith?
defensively
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Or Seattle and Hasselbeck last year
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
yes
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
Brees just broke the all-time passing record with the offense he has
Why on earth would he want to come to KC to be coached by Bill Muir (unlikely) or some yet unknown OC?
joplin chiefs fan - January 15, 2012
Why would Manning?
Hell Kansas City is worse than Cleveland and Akron and Detroit rolled into one
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
I think Manning would almost prefer a weak OC
that way he could do things his way. But yeah, if Manning was uninjured and playing at the top of his game, there’s no way in hell he’d consider KC either.
joplin chiefs fan - January 15, 2012
given the current situation with the colts manning would consider kc alot
the colts are in rebuild and manning got a few years to play if healthy
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
They want him.
And he wants them.
So no, they’ll get a deal done before it gets to that.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Let's go Texans!
Whoo!
bossmanham - January 15, 2012 via mobile
Do the Chiefs get an asterisk?
since we were the orignal Texans :)
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
Do the Texans get an asterisk for Super Bowl IV?
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Ravens vs Texans
Who gets the chance to lose to Tom Brady in the AFC Championship game…
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Interesting stat at ESPN
New England hasn’t beat a team with a winning record all year.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Yeah
I saw that stuff run all week over at mile high report. rofl.
Brady looks more focused than ever to win this year. Not betting against Brady.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Packers haven't lost to a team with a winning record all year
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I think
49rs defense is similar to our D in terms of their skill talent across the board with great LB and CB who can cover. They also have the luxury of a more consistent pass rush, and I think Packs are going to lose to the 49rs if they beat the giants today.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
wasn't really the point
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
oh
what was your point?
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
that stats can be misleading
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
haha Touche!
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
niiice.
independent739 - January 15, 2012
A good defence and a running game... I think Texans could give them a tough match up
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
Maybe
Brady and his O line looked better than ever against the broncos. Theres a chance Texans or Ravens could be a tough mathcup. But i see both of these teams, especially with their QBs getting overwhelmed by Brady and the Pats in Foxborough early.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
I think the only team that stops the Patriots this year are the Giants.
And I need that to happen so my better half doesn’t get angry at me for betting on the Giants to win tonight.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Haha
it’s not likely they’ll win, but it could definitely happen. They do seem to beat teams they aren’t suppose to beat
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
The odds were right.
I’m counting on them being the healthiest they’ve been all year, the defense coming around and their ability to pressure with their front four to give them a chance. Also Eli has finally turned me into a believer and their 3 WRs might be better then the 3 WRs GB puts on the field.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Did you bet on them to win, or cover?
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Win on one bet and cover on my other ticket to cover my ass.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Pollard sighting...
independent739 - January 15, 2012
I forgot he played for the Ravens
joplin chiefs fan - January 15, 2012
Wasn't good enough to play for the Chiefs and Texans
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
did herm cut pollard
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
I'm glad State Farm finally filmed some new commercials
I was getting sick of the same ole’ Discount Double-Check
joplin chiefs fan - January 15, 2012
Wow. What a D-Line.
independent739 - January 15, 2012
Texans aren't missing Mario Williams at all
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
Did you see him this year?
I’d bet my shirt he’s on his way out of town this offseason.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
I did, i moved to Austin TX last spring so I watch them on local TV and Chiefs on computer. He's too big to play OLB in 3-4. Brooks Reed has really progressed well in his place. same with Barwin
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
I have never seen a player look that awkward in space.
They really should’ve lined him up opposite of Watt or something. What a mess. Considering they had a top 5 defense without him, they have to see how expendable he is now and he still has alot of trade value.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
they should be able to get a 1st rd pick for him, of course coming back from an injury might scare some teams
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
Not really a fit for 3-4 at all
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Alright, I haven't ever seen him play, so someone help me out here.
Yates > Cassel ?
independent739 - January 15, 2012
Ray Lewis is like a pitbul... He doesn't let go
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
terrible decision to throw the ball there
Chiefs_KC - January 15, 2012
All the concern is what happens with Luck/Manning next year...
What happens with Schaub/Yates next year? Clearly Shaub won’t lose his job next year, but how long does Houston hang onto Yates.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Until his contract is up (probably 4 years)
saskwatch - January 15, 2012
this playing time is very valuable....
even if he is only a career back-up…..its gonna make him some money later down the road
KCinAZ - January 15, 2012
i spoke too soon
he just threw another pick…lol
KCinAZ - January 15, 2012
I would have liked to see what stanzi had to offer.
PSUkegreen - January 15, 2012
Schaub has one year left on his contract.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Ed Reed is still the man.
saskwatch - January 15, 2012
Why does he keep throwing that ball up like that??
KCinAZ - January 15, 2012
He is a 5th round rookie. You would be better off playing Palko than him. :)
saskwatch - January 15, 2012
oh no....give him more credit than that
he has put 13 points up against the Ravens D….Palko would have -13
KCinAZ - January 15, 2012
Cassel put up what?
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
who cares...
i dont want either one of them in KC next year
KCinAZ - January 15, 2012
Smart Ass :)
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
rookies
make rookie mistakes
fongKC - January 15, 2012
turnovers are 4-0 and its a one score game?
Good luck in Foxborough Baltimore.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Baltimore is old and on the decline. Houston with Shaub beats them today.
saskwatch - January 15, 2012
Pittsburgh is old and on the decline.
We get both next year
Steve_Chiefs - January 15, 2012
this just got real
PSUkegreen - January 15, 2012
Best FB in the league my ass.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Anyone else watching this game
and thinking even with the mistakes, they would rather have Yates than Cassel?
bonesjackson - January 15, 2012
yea i was thinking that but i might be happy with stanzi
PSUkegreen - January 15, 2012
Well,
he does have the 3 interception game / looking down his primary receiver skills. So no.
Druful - January 15, 2012
tj yates
Better than Cassel plz get a real qb in kc flynn yates. Orton anyone but cassel
rickrock58 - January 15, 2012
getting flynn would put us in the exact same scenario as when we got Cassel
Despite popular opinion, Orton is the exact same QB as Cassel, ie a game manager.
MarineChiefsFan - January 15, 2012
But a better game manager.
With a better arm, that can actually read defenses and make progressions.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
so
Flynn has expe
rickrock58 - January 15, 2012
Two games against two of the worst passing defenses in the league on a team with offensive weapons that 90% of the league doesnt have.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
And a well oiled system with a real play caller.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
who cares if he reads the defense if he still throws it straight to them.
At least Cassel has shown he can protect the football
MarineChiefsFan - January 15, 2012
When
has he done that? Ive seen him have absolutely no pocket awareness and get sacked.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
2010
27 TDs 7 Ints
MarineChiefsFan - January 15, 2012
yeah
and 0td and 3 int against the ravens, are you kidding me you clearly dont watch Cassel play.
Terrible accuracy, inadequate arm strength, cant read a defense, no pocket awareness, prone to turnovers, lack of pocket awareness, not athletic,cant convert on 3rd downs ever.
He has absolutely nothing going for him other than the fact that he is a “great leader” by being so resilient at sucking.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Small Sample Size FTW!!!
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
wow
you really dont watch football. Im honestly tired of idiots wanting Cassel to keep playing for the Chiefs.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
If you are using one game to prove anything
then you clearly don’t understand anything
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
No
I just thought by now that people have watched a couple seasons of Cassel and finally realized how crappy of a QB he is.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Ive seen as many seasons of Cassel being good as bad.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
No one
is saying Cassel is a great, good, or even average QB. Just saying that Orten is not signficantly better overall. Not sure why you’re not getting this.
Druful - January 15, 2012
Im not saying
Orton is a franchise QB. I dont understand why youre not getting the fact that Cassel is flat out one of the worst QBs in the league, and Orton is not.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Orten's
rating is 81.1, Cassel’s is 76.4 and Orten led us to one touchdown per game like clockwork. Orten is a bad QB who is better then Cassel, but he’s still bad.
Druful - January 15, 2012
Of course comparing 9 games to 3 games
isn’t exactly definitive
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Especially when the 3 games
was on a new team, with a dislocated finger.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
But like I've been saying all along.
And no one has even tried to counter.
That we don’t know if Orton looked better because he is better, or because the offense clearly changed after Haley was fired.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I liked Orton before he became a Chief.
And just going by the eye test, he looked a lot better to me than Cassel. I hope we get more games to evaluate with him next season.
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
Making excuses?
I’m suprised.
Anyway, his career stats line up pretty well with his 3 game rental in KC. And career stats over 6 years are pretty definative.
Druful - January 15, 2012
Well if you are gonna play the career line
Cassel has a QB rating of 82.8 as a starter.
I really don’t have a favorite in this discussion, and I really could care less who the QB is next year. with either guy the offense won’t be great next year.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Ummm
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Yeah it was an honesty question
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
3>1
MarineChiefsFan - January 15, 2012
So what you are really saying is that if you ignore the last game
Cassel was 27-4. Even better numbers.
MarineChiefsFan - January 15, 2012
No he was
27-10 in the regular season…
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
And
if you actuallly Watched those games, you woudl know Cassel was absolutely horrible and could not move the ball and it was basically all Jamaal Charles that year.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
and if you watched the games the previous year he took the Chiefs to the playoffs
while protecting the ball
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Yeah
cuz with so many good QBs in the league now, I would play Cassel who “takes care” of the ball for one season while Charles jsut dominates defense instead of a QB who can actually exploit the defense stacking 8 or 9 in the box
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Yeah, because Orton really exploited defenses this year
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Looked better than Cassel
with no Jamaal or Tomo
EricBerryYoYouScary - January 15, 2012
The offense was also significantly different...
Like I said earlier.
Did Orton play better because the offense was opened up after Haley left, or is Orton actually an upgrade over Cassel.
You can’t really prove either.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
So
why the hell would you go with Cassel who has shown no positives except for the fact that he played after an appendectomy against teh rams.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
you sure love your hyperbole
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
then
what aspect of his QB has been a positive?
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
3100 yards last year with only 7 picks
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Those
are stats. We can also see that he was 26th in accuracy that year. What part of his QB play is a positive?
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
You said he is that Cassel has no positives
Im just giving things that disprove that
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I guess the only way to prove it
is start Orton next season :)
EricBerryYoYouScary - January 15, 2012
Or Cassel
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
We already know what Cassel can do.
And it’s not good enough.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
We don't know what Cassel will do without Haley
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
What
part of his QB play is such a positive that he would prove to be a successful QB if Haley goes out?
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
He did go to a Pro Bowl last year
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
That
is not an aspect of QB play. Did he show good consistency in throwing the ball? Did he show good accuracy? Did he show good decision making? Did he show good QB pocket awareness?
What part of his QB play is so appealing to you?
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
When did I ever say he was appealing to me?
You just keep using hyperbole and circumstantial evidence that proves nothing
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Well
im just asking what is your defense of Cassel? What makes him a good QB? I just honestly want to know why you think he is a better QB than Orton.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
He's not.
Going through progressions- Orton
Deep ball- Orton
Accuracy- Orton
Pocket presence- Orton
Not to mention a really good play action qb. With Jamaal back. drool
EricBerryYoYouScary - January 15, 2012
So you're saying Orton > Palko?
Tarkus - January 15, 2012
I never said he was
I asked is Orton a better QB than Cassel.
And everything you have said is hyperbole and circumstantial.
Nothing you have said definitively says that Orton is better than Cassel. We don’t know if Orton looked better because he is better, or if Cassel looked worse because Haley was holding an arm behind his back…
Because here is what I know. The offensive play calling was dramatically better after Haley was fired.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I have a feeling it will be more of the same.
Staring down his primary receiver and expecting him to make a great catch. That and panicking in the pocket and somehow falling into a defender. More consistent 3-and-outs.
EricBerryYoYouScary - January 15, 2012
We've already seen what Cassel can do with those weapons.
EricBerryYoYouScary - January 15, 2012
13 turnovers in 9 games while only putting up 10 TDs?
“Protecting the football” is a great trait of a backup QB.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Not arguing with that
My point is that Orton’s biggest strength is that he is the replacement QB. Not because he actually came in and did something with the team.
MarineChiefsFan - January 15, 2012
was the KC offense really any better with Orton?
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
+999999999999999999999999
MarineChiefsFan - January 15, 2012
And actually
I seem to remember scoring more TDs this year with Cassel
MarineChiefsFan - January 15, 2012
Heres what I saw...
I saw a more aggressive offense after Haley got fired. I don’t know if that was Orton or Haley.
But they didn’t really score any more points.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Orton
beat the packers, should have been Oakland if it wasnt for the two blocked field goals which he could do nothign about, and beat denver.
Cassel would have lost all three games outright.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Circumstantial evidence is Circumstantial
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Or
the interception he threw in the endzone.
Druful - January 15, 2012
Apples to oranges.
Give Orton an offseason of work with the team and in the system with an actual running game behind him and it’s hard to not understand why people would be more optimistic about him then Cassel.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
that may be...
Or give Cassel a chance without Haley and its hard not to understand why you could be more optimistic about Cassel.
I mean, I like Orton more. But I don’t think any evidence we have is definite one way or the other
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Except
we should go with what evidence we do have.
And all evidence points to the fact that Orton will make us a more successful team.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
what evidence?
your skills as a pro evaluator?
MarineChiefsFan - January 15, 2012
We are talking about a QB that has been gotten rid of by two teams
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
there been a few great players kc let go only to be good some where else
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
how many of those were QB's?
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
qb wise rich gannon comes to mind
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
Dont forget Grbac
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Word is though that Haley is the reason why Cassel succeeded last year.
So that’s not much of an argument either.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Except I think it was Weis so whatever
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I just think we've seen the ceiling for Cassel.
And the potential of Orton is higher then that. Not endorsing settling for another retread QB but if the only two options next year are Orton and Cassel it’s a no brainer for me.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
I don't think one is that much better than the other...
Aside from Orton’s wicked play fake I haven’t seen anything from him that says he is much better than Cassel.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
He can read defenses, go through progressions,
Convert third down passes. All I know is the offense was better with a guy that was on the team for three weeks with a busted up finger then they did with the guy who’s been with the team for three years.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
except
he can actaully move the ball down the field.
Dont you remember all the 3 and outs with Cassel? it was a miracle if he actually converted on a 3rd down.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Orton threw 1 TD in 3 games.
Hardly moving the ball down the field
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
He threw 1 TD
but he set up more for our running game, but im talking about not going 3 and out.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
oh that whopping 13 points per game...
watch out league
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
He moved the ball down field just fine.
I seem to remember a few TD drops and a complete failure by the o line to open up holes inside the 20 (or anywhere for that matter)
EricBerryYoYouScary - January 15, 2012
I remember Bowe dropping passes from Cassel too
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Yeah
cuz his passes were usually behind or over his receivers.
But bowe did drop passes, and he has improved every year unlike Cassel who has shown the same annual anemic QB play
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
u mean cassel lazer passes to bowe
just like obama is lazer focused on jobs
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
ha
Orton moved the ball fine or don’t u remember throwing deep to cooper and pope and bowe and actually further than 10 yards without much time with our we’d no offseason to learn the playbook and no Jamal charles and made the oline look better come on Orton over Cassel anyway
rickrock58 - January 15, 2012 via Android app
Exactly
There’s more then just yards and points scored. We had issues in the red zone(gold zone) this year because of the running game, but Ortons success also extends to keeping the defense off the field and keeping the field position in our favor.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
weis made cassel
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
yeah
Cassel had 3 years to figure it out he’s done flynn has experience in college and little in the nfl he can play better than Cassel. flynn will have a better run game here in kc all the weapons we have aren’t that bad to greenbays and a improved oline I think Orton should be resigned or flynn picked up cuz Cassel is not the answer how many times you wanna see this guy till you figure out he just ain’t it?
rickrock58 - January 15, 2012 via Android app
Seriously
It’s like the play of palko just erased everyones memories of how shitty Cassel was int he first place.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Seriously
It’s like the play of Orton just erased everyones memories of how shitty Palko was int he first place.
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Ok, so pull out the offseason bullshit arguement.
This isn’t dick vermiel’s playbook. You wanna know the biggest reason he may not have known the playbook? Cause he showed up late. He didn’t want to be here, so he didn’t try.
MarineChiefsFan - January 15, 2012
He didn't try?
This was the best chance that he had to audition for a contract to get paid next year. Why wouldn’t he try? You can’t learn the system and get chemistry with your players in a couple of weeks where more then half the time you couldn’t throw the ball because you had a busted up finger.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
While it is true
they both arent franchise QBs, Orton is a much better QB than Cassel.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
based on what?
Stats? Only if you throw out Ortons worst years, and Cassels best. Kinda handy that you get to do that, huh
MarineChiefsFan - January 15, 2012
not true they both are good but Ortons simply done more with less and hes far ahead of Matt in his mechanics etc
Matts good but hes actually older than Orton but far behind him in his overall development as a qb despite having advantages that Orton would probably break don in tears about and thats what everyone sees . Not simply that they have similar stats so that makes them the same .
Willie Beamon - January 15, 2012
orton a way better qb than cassel
niageriannit1 - January 15, 2012
Flynn?
Not sure anyone knows if he’s real or not. And a report that the Packers aren’t likely going to franchise him and will let him walk is pretty telling.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
Weird play call or execution.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
ed reed is showing his age
PSUkegreen - January 15, 2012
Still a baller.
EricBerryYoYouScary - January 15, 2012
Big loss for the AFC Champ game
bonesjackson - January 15, 2012
BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
CPT.Caveman - January 15, 2012
hmmmmmmmmm
NJChieffan16 - January 15, 2012
They were my pick in the preseason... And if Shaub hadn't gotten hurt It could have come true
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
Agreed
Can’t imagine they lose this game with Shaub and they would’ve been a good matchup vs the Pats.
GenericBrand - January 15, 2012
And they likely would have had a first round bye
averagegatsby - January 15, 2012
I swear
people just forgot how crappy Cassel was as a QB.
I just love seeing our QB with 60 yards at the half with a 0/6 third down conversion rate.
andrew33 - January 15, 2012
Looks like Patriots and Packers. Should be a good game
An old fashioned Shoot out. Brady wins.
Coady - January 15, 2012
Cassel Is The Man
…in 2012! Sorry boys, he’s better than Orton and coming back. Might be time for you to find a new team to follow cause Cassel is our guy.
SullyWA2 - January 15, 2012
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