And we thought this was all over.
Apparently not.
Mike Jurecki of XTRA 910 Sports in Phoenix is reporting that he is "[h]earing" that the Chiefs are "refusing" to pay Todd Haley the remainder of his contract, which suggests that Haley was fired for cause. As in did something detrimental to the team.
And, before anyone asks, playing Tyler Palko probably isn't a reason to fire him, especially when GM Scott Pioli already said, "That was not an issue at all." (I'm not sure the people saying playing Palko is a reason to be fired with cause are actually serious or not...I'm assuming not.)
These are issues usually resolved between the coach, team and the league so the process will move somewhere in that direction if it is indeed accurate.
It used to be the Raiders were the only team who had stories like this written about them, the alleged (and denied) phone bugging and the firing of a coach with cause.
Uh-oh: Are the Chiefs becoming the Raiders?
(Edit: They're actually like seven straight four-win seasons from being the Raiders.)
0 recs | 132 comments
This isn'[t sounding good...
We knew the Hunts were cheap, but this is ridiculous
Bleedingredandgold - January 26, 2012
The thing is
The Chiefs don’t get their side of things out there. Like the Arrowhead Anxiety story, Pioli wasn’t even quoted so we have no clue how he feels about it. Maybe the Chiefs have a reason to fire Haley with cause…we just don’t know (but most fans are going to draw their own conclusions from their silence).
Joel Thorman - January 26, 2012
But
that’s not proof of anythingggggg.
Trying…to….not….comment….can’t….help….myself
bossmanham - January 26, 2012
Just sayin
We’ve all read/seen the same things and two rational people (like you and I) can come to different conclusions. I get that. And I pointed out above — maybe the Chiefs are right in this situation. Who knows? But, in general, if someone credible has reported that something is happening with my team, I can choose to believe even if it’s not the same level of “proof” that you use. I guess this is as close to saying we agree to disagree without actually saying it (twice).
Joel Thorman - January 26, 2012
I agree, and encourage it.
That’s why I come here.
The Chiefs keeping hush about the issue though. What do you think it says? I just think it says they like to keep hush about everything. They may or may not be planning on keeping this money from Haley. If they ARE, they’d better have a really good reason for it.
I mean they paid Herm what he was owed, didn’t they? That’s a lot of money to not do anything with the team. I don’t think this is a good piece of evidence to yank out the “cheap” label. But they didn’t with Haley. That tells me something pretty big happened somewhere.
If not, it’ll come out and the Chiefs will pay for it.
bossmanham - January 26, 2012
You are missing the point, Joel
The Raiders won their case against Lane Kiffen. But look at the fallout. They couldn’t pay enough to land a coach and had to settle with Art Shell.
This is a bad look when we are trying to land a top OC in a big turning point in our franchise.
Nick Britt - January 27, 2012
Wasn't Shell hired right after Norv Turner?
And wasn’t Kiffin hired after Shell?
old_school - January 27, 2012
Cable Followed Kiffin
Not Shell. And the Cable hiring was in line with a 20 year hiring pattern from Al Davis. For the last 20 years in charge, he always followed up an “offensive minded” coach he fired with an offensive line coach. That said, his choices were absolutely restricted because of how he acted towards his coaches.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
Details, details
Point is:
-Don’t be that guy.
Nick Britt - January 27, 2012
Kiss the free agents goodbye.
This does not sound like an organi2ation a stud free agent would wanna get involved with. Really, quite embarrassing.
skunk420 - January 26, 2012
Yeah.
The Raiders have really had trouble signing guys.
Tarkus - January 26, 2012
For actual value YES
Anyone will play for 120% over the next highest bidder…
KSU-Chief - January 26, 2012
Yet
The Chiefs have been more successful under this regime at locking up their own young talent so they don’t hit free agency.
Tito42 - January 26, 2012
If anything is true
between this and the Arrowhead Anxiety article…even just a small number of the things being reported, then I’m just embarrassed.
kc_radrh8r - January 26, 2012
this ^^^
and a few other not so cool incidents like the “charging firefighters to see a game” thing, and the “office staff salary cuts” during the spring
add those plus the Babb article (coffee, really?) and now this … yeah, not looking good for the home team
image-wise
upamtn - January 26, 2012
Were they not supposed to charge the firefighters or something?
Don’t remember hearing about that
KCinIL - January 26, 2012
they requested 100 firefighters to be on the field for a 9/11 pregame ceremony...
…but wanted them to pay to stay and watch the game.
bansky - January 26, 2012
That was dumb as hell.
Was there ever a statement from them on that?
bossmanham - January 26, 2012
As I recall.
Donovan or someone blamed it on someone down on the food chain who was just doing what they thought they were supposed to.
Tarkus - January 26, 2012
Yanno, Pioli just has no tact
seems like a typical East coast bigwig that always gets his way
tomachop - January 27, 2012
There a link?
KCinIL - January 27, 2012
Try a search.
There were multiple stories on it and the Chiefs reversed their decision when it became public.
NJ Chiefs Fan - January 27, 2012
Good thing they did
KCinIL - January 27, 2012
Pioli is too hard headed
And set in his way, which is attempting to be Belicheck and failing at it.
Hope we move on from him soon
GracieKal - January 26, 2012
You know Belicheck...
Isn’t a GM right? If Pioli was this horrible guy do you really think Robert Kraft would have suggested him to Clark?
groundedchevy - January 26, 2012 via mobile
Why wouldn’t he? Are they in some fraternity of Good Guy Greg’s where they help their competitors?
manofnothi - January 27, 2012
I'm saving judgement but Pioli's act could become old real fast
truechief10 - January 26, 2012
Really?
bossmanham - January 26, 2012
I mean, not really serious (considering the joke right after it)
But it’s usually the Raiders who are portrayed like this.
Joel Thorman - January 26, 2012
Yeah.
I was hoping this would all end and we’d have ourselves a nice little offseason.
Haha.
bossmanham - January 26, 2012
sorry man, this has been covered in spades in fanshots already
we’re done with it, discussion over already ;-)
upamtn - January 26, 2012
I know, I know
I’m really late.
Joel Thorman - January 26, 2012
no worries, Joel
you’ve had a busy day with all the OC gnus
upamtn - January 26, 2012
I wish the Chiefs would become the Raiders
At least they’ve been to and won a Super Bowl during our life times
HIV 2 Elway - January 26, 2012
try being a chiefs fan in the 80's
niageriannit1 - January 26, 2012
Palko was worthy of getting fired
Stanzi >>>> Palko
Ans Stanzi has never played a down
ArrowheadHunter - January 26, 2012
Hmmm.
Oh well. Don’t really have anything to say about this. I guess I’ll be interested if the whole story comes out but I won’t hold my breath. Other than that I can’t say that I really care.
When is the draft again?
Lucasjr5 - January 26, 2012
I can be on board with this attitude
Joel Thorman - January 26, 2012
Yeah.
Just freaking win some football games.
bossmanham - January 26, 2012
omg! I just realized something ...
Scott Pioli
Sarah Palin
both have the same initials
both have the same amount of letters in both first and last names
they are never seen together
omg!
think about it …
upamtn - January 26, 2012
LMAO!
WorL4Chiefs - January 26, 2012
it just came to me ... sudden burst of white light inspiration :-)
upamtn - January 26, 2012
they say cross dresing is an art
tomachop - January 27, 2012
They're both guilty of spouting complete and total bullshit to the press...that's for sure.
Scott B. - January 26, 2012
Disagree
not putting the players on the field that give you the best chance to win
playing a guy that you know is gunna lose just to try and stick it to your boss
cant get much more detrimental to the team than that
sorry but Haley was not doing the job that he was hired to do, so why should the Chiefs have to pay him the remainder of his contract
badassz1987 - January 26, 2012
Can you explain to me
When Pioli or Haley came out and said that Palko was Haley’s guy? How do we know that Pioli wasnt the guy making Haley play Palko
isimo - January 26, 2012 via mobile
So you believe that Pioli
signed Orton and paid him $2 million only to then turn around and force Haley to play Palko?
badassz1987 - January 26, 2012
Pioli could have cut Palko any day he wanted.
manofnothi - January 27, 2012
after one week of practice? Lots of coaches would have done the same.
electriclight - January 27, 2012
I thought releasing Gaither was the reason for me
tomachop - January 27, 2012
Calm down everyone
I really think that Todd really was the issue since day one. Anyone remember the 22 guys off the street crap he spewed to Brian Waters not two months into his tenure? Not only was that arrogant crap coming from someone who had never played the game but also was pretty arrogant for someone with no head coaching experience at ANY LEVEL.
I think he really went off the deep end the past 12 months with the hobo look and lack of preparedness. He went through one OC per year, was a mad man on the sidelines and sounded like he was loaded on Oxycontin whenever he spoke to the media.
Let’s face it, the guy was over his head and lacked the self awareness to understand that he was. Frankly, considering the beat downs we endured this season with Todd at the helm, I think the team deserves their cash back.
Spruce - January 26, 2012
I think another thing against Haley in this regard
Is that when he was fired, the players literally got a jolt of energy and played well (Beating Packers). Even though we sucked it up against Oakland the next week the team seemed to play hard for Romeo and were even saying “RAC CITY!!” on their Twitter accounts.
I don’t recall hearing a single squeak of a cry or negative comment from the players when Haley left. Makes you think he lost the team long ago…
Tyran - January 26, 2012
Just weeks before he was fired players such as Derrick Johnson were singing Haley’s praises. Then they sing Crennel’s praises. If I recall, the players liked Herm Edwards. That’s how players are. They’ll love every coach.
NotAHippie - January 26, 2012
Couldn't agree more
The players probably felt it was a slap in the face with the “I’m putting out the players that give us the best absolute chance to win” and then he runs Palko out there. Glad this dudes long gone.
KCinIL - January 26, 2012
No Argument About Haley
I wanted him fired in year one after he basically threw the Philadelphia game at halftime. I backed off when he started getting a few wins, but the best I ever thought of the guy was “At least he isn’t the worst coach in the NFL.” (until Palko).
That said, just because Todd Haley was a cancer and a problem doesn’t mean that Scott Pioli isn’t also a cancer and a problem. You notice that nobody seems to be in a rush to come to KC to fill those coordinator slots, even though people seem to like Crennel. KC seems to have developed a rep as a place that people don’t want to come work…and that kind of rep usually means there are systemic problems, which is indicative of bad leadership up top.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
It's a combination of Haley and the KC sports media
the KC sports media has been butthurt since Pioli got to town b/c he won’t take them to the square dance. It’s full of a bunch of career chasers who try to dig up dirt on any and every personality in town in order to further their career and get them a “promotion” to a national gig. Not saying all of the media is like that, but most of the prominent ones seem to be.
Haley was simply just a terrible coach and a crazy human being. That he was associated with the Chiefs for 3 years has hurt the teams rep and yes I do blame Pioli for that one. Never should have hired him in the first place.
Bonofied - January 27, 2012
Absolutely.
TheScootness - January 27, 2012
Anyone remember the 22 guys off the street crap he spewed to Brian Waters not two months into his tenure?
That was Pioli too.
Budd Jones - January 27, 2012
I don't recall Pioli being involved in that quote.
Bonofied - January 27, 2012
He backed his coach
and refused to meet with Waters too.
Not sure backing a new coach is a terrible thing, but…
NJ Chiefs Fan - January 27, 2012
That's because it wasn't a quote
Haley wasn’t quoted either. I understand it will always live in Chiefs folklore, but to green a comment that uses it as a supporting argument for a stance is wrong.
old_school - January 27, 2012
And just to be clear
There is more and more coming down against this organization, so I’m not defending them anymore. But there are plenty of other more credible supporting arguments to use.
old_school - January 27, 2012
Fair Enough, But
It’s not like Brian Waters had a history of throwing coaches and management under the bus before Haley and Pioli arrived. And it’s not like he’s done it since. The guy was a team leader and not a cancer…something happened with that incident that made him react very differently from how he’d acted up to that point.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
Hope Haley sues the Chiefs. He can join the others.
This is the logical end to what the Chiefs have done to themselves. Pioli undermined his coach with the media during the season. That alone wins Haley’s case. If Pioli wants that lawsuit with all the age discrimination cases, fine. Let’s have the depositions. Let’s have the leaks. Let’s take a good look at what Scott Pioli has been up to.
ChiefConcern - January 26, 2012
Can't sue.
Would go to NFL arbitration.
That was my first thought as well.
NJ Chiefs Fan - January 27, 2012
Maybe the "cause" will become apparent...
When Pioli releases those secretly taped cell phone conversations Haley had?
Or maybe Scott has some surveillance video of Haley snorting a line?
No telling.
Sure makes our team look bad…whatever the case. When we’re looking for new coordinators, and Free Agent players before too long?
I sure miss the days when the Chiefs were at least referred to as an organization that had “class”. We might have sucked…but we had some “class” at least. Now…we just suck.
Whether or not some of all this negative bullshit is true…the perception of it all is getting out there to the masses. And perception is 9/10ths of the law. Or, something like that.
Scott B. - January 26, 2012
can't take sides on this one.
anyone else get the feeling that haley & pioli are both a couple of assholes that the chiefs’ fans and chiefs’ players are better off not thinking about too much?
Chief Farmer - January 26, 2012
My growing fear is...that the wrong "asshole" was fired.
For the sake of the team that I love, I hope that feeling is wrong.
Scott B. - January 26, 2012
Oh, come on.
You’d rather Pioli was fired and Todd Haley was still the coach? Lend me some of that shit you are smoking.
neiowakcfan - January 27, 2012
Haley Had To Go
But that doesn’t mean Pioli has been doing a good job.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
It just may be time for Pioli to leave...?
DisplacedChief - January 26, 2012
If they feel they have cause
Then theres obviously more to everything than the 1-sided stories we been getting. Some people need to calm down with the “see, Piolis the devil!” “he needs to go” yada yada yada. Just sounds ignorant.
KCinIL - January 26, 2012
Then maybe Scott should spin a little positive press his own way...and put an end to some of the speculations.
The hush hush bullshit on game day things is fine. But when it affects the way the whole damn team / organization / city looks? Then fucking speak up and say something.
Scott B. - January 26, 2012
Right
He should speak up everytime bullshit is spread, yeah, ok. The only person lookin like an idiot right now is Haley and the stupid story that came out that everyone thought would be top story for weeks and was wiped away a few days later. The dude doesn’t need to say shit but work on our offseason, period.
KCinIL - January 26, 2012
Exactly
I’m tired of the fucking media and some fans acting like they are entitled to hear Pioli and Hunt’s thoughts on every fucking conspiracy out there. I’d be pissed if they spent the time answering these questions as opposed to doing their damn jobs.
Bonofied - January 27, 2012
It's A Business With A High Profile
If Hunt and Pioli don’t want to talk to the press and don’t get their spin on the stories out there, speculation is going to happen. They’re in the wrong business if they want anonymity.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
You don't hear this crap with other cities
except the usual suspects, NY, Chicago, Philly, Boston and to some extent LA. KC Media has it in their heads that they need to be like the “big boys” and investigate every inch of Arrowhead in hopes of churning out some “pulitzer material”. I know I don’t care if I hear Hunt and Pioli commenting on any of these accusations. All I want out of them is good players, good coaches and a good gameday experience. I don’t care about the TMZ shit.
Bonofied - January 27, 2012
Disagreed
If anything, the local media has been more quiet than the national press about Babb’s story. This was a big story…you’ve got a GM who apparently engaged in a very personal and toxic grudge match with his head coach and there are allegations that he was wiretapping employees. That is not something you hear from other teams.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
No one alleged that except Haley.
Others speculated, at most saying “they wouldn’t be surprised.” (Which means Babb led them with a question)
Read the actual article.
bossmanham - January 27, 2012
I Did
And Babb made it clear, both there and in interviews he’s done since, that employees believe the team installs a culture of fear and paranoia.
If you don’t want to believe what Babb wrote, that’s your prerogative.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
Fired former employees feeling they were scared and paranoid.
Different than accusations of wiretapping.
Come on.
bossmanham - January 27, 2012
Like I Said
When it’s one or two employees making fairly outlandish accusations, that’s an anomaly…more than that, it’s a pattern. But believe what you want.
That said, I don’t really care if Pioli is bugging the team’s offices and screaming about candy wrappers or if he isn’t, as long as he’s producing. But he isn’t producing. Before Kyle Orton fell on our laps, the best he could do for a backup QB after three years was Tyler Fucking Palko. The team lacks depth at most positions, his drafting has been scattershot, free agency has been terrible, and his top choice for coach was apparently a train wreck. The end result of that is that while this team might be competitive in one of the worst divisions in football, he’s still nowhere close to building a Super Bowl team or even winning a playoff game. That tells me that he’s doing things wrong…and as such, I don’t feel any obligation to give him the benefit of the doubt on any of the accusations if we don’t see dramatic improvement next year. Right now, he’s just another Bill Belichick protege who’s shown he wasn’t anything special once he wasn’t working for Belichick.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
Simple really
You break your confidentiality agreement by going around spreading crazy rumors about bugged cellphones and whatnot (true or not) and your contract is void.
CapsLockKey - January 26, 2012
Yes!
This is the first thing that came to mind. If true, it would indicate that there is some truth to what was reported that he is saying, otherwise, why would Hunt/Pioli care?
IamDoomsday - January 27, 2012
They would care if it were a lie too
If Haley was going around bad mouthing the team with lies Hunt/Pioli would care, if he was going around bad mouthing with the truth they would care too, per the confidentiality agreement.
nateforchiefs - January 27, 2012
Except that was all second hand accounts from Kent Babb.
I didn’t see one quote from Haley breaking anything confidential.
Budd Jones - January 27, 2012
True. Of course we dont know for sure yet if the Chiefs are going to withhold the pay or not.
It looks pathetic to do that, even if you are in the right. Better to pay the man and move on.
nateforchiefs - January 27, 2012
Except he said it to Babb BEFORE he was fired
And we have no idea whether they were crazy rumors or not.
dablueguy - January 27, 2012
Romeo could well be our only saving grace....
…because what FA worth his salt is going to want to come play for the turd of an organization that the Chiefs have turned into. And you know what they say about trying to polish a turd……
Pioli may have saved a sinking ship by that one move, but the water-tight compartments seem to be filling up, little by little.
I just can’t believe what this Pioli hiring has evolved into. It could only happen to the Chiefs nation, one of the most loyal, but emotionally battered fan bases in the NFL.
KC_Native - January 26, 2012
Thank Clark Hunt
HIV 2 Elway - January 26, 2012
I dunno.
Is every free agent on AP all day long like us? Is this stuff even real prevalent in the national news?
bossmanham - January 26, 2012
ESPN, Yahoo!, and NationalFootballPost
all picked it up.
Chiefs’ PR reads the site and I wouldn’t be surprised if other teams/agents do as well.
Arrowhead Pride has been quoted or linked to by multiple national and local radio programs and websites.
NJ Chiefs Fan - January 27, 2012
Yup
Actually, the Kansas City media made a smaller deal of Babb’s story than the national media did. It was huge. Babb did an interview where he discussed how the Chiefs actually leaned on broadcasters they had arrangements with to pressure them not to push the story.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
Maybe Pioli caught Haley snorting lines of coke off a strippers ass on his desk
Is that just cause?
jmcgoblue - January 26, 2012
Was she hot?
Tarkus - January 26, 2012
this is the deciding factor
trentchiefsfan - January 27, 2012
Maybe Pioli caught Haley snorting lines of coke off Pioli's ass
We’ll never really know what happens behind the scenes.
DrDC - January 26, 2012
How exactly is this all Pioli's fault?
Think about every negative headline that had the Chiefs in the national news in the past 2 years.
Every single one of them has something to do with Todd Haley.
-Todd Haley doesn’t shake Diet Hoodie’s hand in a loss last year.
-Charlie Weis leaves the NFL to take an OC job at the University of Florida. While everyone suspects friction between him and Haley, Weis tries to take the Patriot way high road by saying he wanted to coach with his volunteer assisstant son at FU. (Or is it UofF, whichever). Notice that touching situation lasted all of ONE SEASON until Weis got a gig at the College Football Program of Misfit Toys that is Kansas.
-Todd Haley has “comments” for Ravens head coach Harbaugh after a PRE-SEASON game. I realize he might have thought Harbaugh was running up the score, but dude, it is a pre-season game. Not exactly the situation to worry about something so trivial as a scoreboard that doesn’t matter.
-Todd Haley looking for wire taps in his office and living in a “culture of fear”. Seriously. An NFL coach worried about his own GM tapping his phones.
I teach high school students and generally, the really paranoid ones who are always looking for someone to blame, are the guiltiest ones of all trying to cover their butts.
But it’s all Pioli’s fault. Well, I guess it is. For hiring Todd Haley.
UNIPanther - January 26, 2012
No, It's His Fault For HIRING Haley
Todd Haley was THE guy that Pioli wanted when he took the job. Didn’t really look at anyone else…he hired a petulant, paranoid, combative ass who couldn’t get along with any offensive coordinator who was competent at doing their job. And those are ingrained personal qualities. Haley didn’t suddenly become that way once he got to KC. He had a reputation for not being able to get along with people BEFORE Pioli hired him, Pioli KNEW the guy personally. The guy had a lawsuit pending against a fast food place…the kind of people who do that sort of thing are not people you put in charge. And Pioli didn’t reign the guy in at the start when Haley started going off the rails with how he dealt with Brian Waters (insulting one of the locker room leaders in a ridiculous confrontation) and Chan Gailey (who he fired TWO WEEKS before the season started, wasting the entire preseason’s work on offense). It’s completely fair to blame Pioli for Haley’s behavior because this was his top candidate for the head coaching job and he was apparently a head case…and Pioli, despite knowing him wasn’t able to figure that out. It calls into question just how competent of a manager of people Scott Pioli is. If he KNOWS people and can’t figure out they’re a terrible fit, he’s a terrible person to have as a GM.
UCrawford - January 26, 2012
He took a chance.
I can’t blame him for doing that. He figured it out and didn’t take a chance this time.
bossmanham - January 27, 2012 via mobile
I Don't Blame Him For Taking Chances
But let’s not overlook just how much of a meltdown Todd Haley had that finally got him fired. He basically quit grooming himself, he apparently decided to start an untalented quarterback out of spite, he couldn’t get along with any of his offensive coordinators, he made accusations about people bugging his phones. If you’re the boss in any other job and you’ve got an employee like that, you either refer him to psych services or fire him and get security to escort him out of the building as quickly as possible because that’s the kind of guy who potentially shows up one day with a shotgun.
Thing is…much of this stuff wasn’t new with Haley. He started acting like this, publicly and on television, before KC even hired him. If you take a risk like that, you’d better be damned sure it pays off because your ass belongs on the chopping block if you hire someone with a history of personality problems and he burns out like Todd Haley did,
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
I agree that Pioli should not have hired Haley in the first place
but I think he’s gotten enough talent in place here to earn at least a second chance with another coach. I think that when he hired Haley he was trying to be the New England genius who could find the diamond in the rough with no experience (Haley) who was somewhat Parcells-like (and didn’t Parcells even suggest Haley to Pioli?). It took a year too long IMO, but he eventually got rid of Haley and essentially admitted his mistake of hiring him in the first place. Now all of this stuff coming out about the KC organization is coming from people who have been fired, including Haley, and I don’t believe a word of it.
Bonofied - January 27, 2012
I'm Fine With Giving Him Two More Years
I should probably clarify that I wasn’t saying I think Pioli should be fired right now. I generally stick to the rule that new GMs deserve at least five years on the job or two coaching hires (whichever comes first) before you should consider firing them. I’m willing to give Pioli some benefit of the doubt that Todd Haley was a major problem, but his own choices and behavior are definitely an area of concern for me now. After all, not only did he hire Haley, but it was a conscious decision of Pioli to make Haley the face of the franchise. He said when he got hired that he wanted the head coach doing the interviews, not the GM…that he selected a coach so utterly unsuited for that role raises major questions about Pioli’s decision making abilities.
Let’s put it this way…if the Chiefs don’t win a playoff game in the next two years and they’re still running things the same way at Arrowhead, I’ll be calling for Pioli’s head. Pioli may or may not be at fault if they fail to win a playoff game, but he hasn’t done anything to convince me so far that he’s more than mediocre…at best. The Chiefs can do better than mediocre.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
As For The "Cheap" Label On Hunt
I’m going to question just how you can claim a guy who just spent a boatload of cash resigning key free agents the last two years (Flowers, Charles, Johnson) can be labeled as “cheap”? David Glass is cheap. Every time KC has developed a good player since Glass bought the team (except for Mike Sweeney) Glass has let him walk in free agency or traded him before he had to re-sign him. And that’s with one of the lowest payrolls and without a salary cap to worry about. Hunt isn’t cheap…he has apparently spent every time his GM has requested money for a player. He continued to keep Chan Gailey on the payroll even after Pioli and Haley fired him. He didn’t balk at paying Herm Edwards for his last contract year (despite Herm putting in pretty much zero effort his last season as HC).
No, this smells like it’s ALL Pioli. The Patriots front office had a rep for nickel and diming players back when he was the GM there (anyone else remember when they convinced Brady to take a paycut so they could get him a receiving corps and then pocketed the cash?), he’s the one who hasn’t appeared to make any effort to sign free agents, he’s the one who had the personality dispute with Haley. Clark Hunt can be blamed, perhaps, for being a little TOO hands-off with the people he hires and for letting other people set the tone for his franchise, but considering the wide latitude he seems to have given both Carl Peterson and Scott Pioli in doing their jobs, as well as the money he’s spent the last three years, I don’t see much reason to believe he’s driving this crap going on at Arrowhead.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
You don't know anything about the Royals if you think Glass has been cheap recently
He hasn’t been cheap for a while.
The Royals last year had the lowest major league payroll, true. But there was no one worth spending real money on. The team was young, and therefore cheap.
The truth is the Royals and Glass have spent more money on the draft and on international free agents than just about any team. That’s will hopefully soon make the major league team better.
NotAHippie - January 27, 2012
You Are Correct About The Recent Trend
But Glass has been running the team for almost 20 years, and for 15 of those he was unquestionably cheap. And if Dayton Moore ends up getting fired, I have little doubt that the next GM will be working with a restricted budget again. Glass spent for a few years and it still hasn’t produced a winner…if he’s going to lose, my money is on him going back to losing cheaply.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
Actually,
there have been negative stories about making firefighters that participated in 9/11 pre-game ceremonies to pay to stay for the game, making parking attendants leave when they are done rather than watching the remainder of the game, creating an environment of fear and intimidation in the workplace, and attempting to blacklist local reporters that publish stories the organization doesn’t like.
That’s off the top of my head. Pretty sure there have been more.
NJ Chiefs Fan - January 27, 2012
Rumors, rumors, rumors.
KC fan base (large part of it anyways) and media are a bunch of paranoid people. I’m sick of it. What’s wrong with supporting the team and enjoying the games on Sunday? Pioli has taken us a long way from the Herm years, but now I’m worried the KC media is going to get him fired and we’ll be back to square one. No wonder KC hasn’t won anything relevant since ‘85 and even that wasn’t deserved.
Bonofied - January 27, 2012
Where There's Smoke...
If it was one or two stories, I’d probably agree. If it was just Todd Haley being paranoid about his phone or office being tapped, I’d write off the stories as ridiculous. But it wasn’t just one person making those claims. And it hasn’t been just one story about bizarre, hostile or vindictive behavior with how this team is being run. There’s enough out there that there’s probably more to it than rumors. After all, you don’t hear this many bad stories being spread about most teams…not even the Patriots.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
Spygate? The Jets' locker room issues, etc..? Jay Cutler?
You hear it all the time from places where their sports media has nothing better to do than fill asinine back pages and generate talk radio fodder. It’s even more glaring when the front office’s of those teams don’t want to play the game with the local media, because then you get reporters trying to find stories where very little or nothing exists. I just hope Clark Hunt isn’t affected by all of the rumors and doesn’t fire Pioli for “public relations” reasons. I also hope that potential coaches and FA’s aren’t dissuaded from coming here because the media is throwing a hissy fit that they don’t get exclusive interviews with Pioli and Hunt every time they want one. The only reason King Carl made it as long as he did here (after the initial winning years) was because he played the local media like a fiddle. I’d prefer that Pioli just focus on his football job and not placating the local columnists.
Bonofied - January 27, 2012
I Should Rephrase
You haven’t heard those kind of stories since Pioli left.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
From New England Anyway
They still fudge their injury reports, but have you noticed that everything there seems more media-friendly now that Pioli’s gone?
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
Can't say I notice it
but I don’t really have first-hand experience with the Boston local media. I know that on NFL network and ESPN I hear the same amount of coverage on the Patriots, maybe more but I attribute that to all the ex-Pats who are now working for ESPN. I was pretty surprised when Bill Belichick did a “Mic’ed up” show for NFL network, but I don’t think that was because Pioli wasn’t there holding him back, just that he’s grown over the years and is more open about things like that.
Now that I think about it, how much control over how the team dealt with the media did Pioli have in NE? He was in charge of player personnel and arguably Belichick had at least as much control over that department as Pioli did. Nobody will probably ever know except for those involved, but I think it’s a question that many don’t think about. As far as Pioli as GM of KC I think he was been a mixed bag, but I don’t see how anyone can argue that he hasn’t been a vast improvement over late-Peterson and Herm. He could make some better roster decisions IMO, but mostly I like the roster and his choice in first coach was epically bad. I’ll give him 1-2 coaches before I start re-evaluating the decision to hire Scott Pioli.
Bonofied - January 27, 2012
Peterson-Pioli Comparison
I think the better comparison would be how does he stack up against early career Peterson…and the answer is not well. Actually, he doesn’t even stack up well against Peterson’s last three years. His three drafts stack up poorly against Peterson’s last three drafts and he’s worse at free agency. His coaching hire was terrible (although not as bad as Herm), but the really damning thing for me was that while Peterson had a terrible backup QB in Brodie Croyle on the roster for three years, the best Pioli could do for getting a backup QB was two more years of Croyle before downgrading to Tyler Palko. And yes, Palko was a downgrade from Croyle. Basically, Pioli hasn’t shown he’s an improvement on Peterson at all to my mind…even late career Peterson.
UCrawford - January 30, 2012
Hate to say it but this is what I have been saying for years now. The Hunt family is a greedy bunch of business people worried about $$ over winning. .
Most the NFL insiders already know this…it’s now just slowly getting out to the KC public.
NFL season ticket holder - January 26, 2012
You couldn't be more wrong.
Look at all the good Lamar has done for the community and the league as a whole. All indications are that Clark is following in his dad’s footsteps. He is signing the people that Pioli has targeted, even giving big contracts to our own players that deserve them. I’d be curious to hear what “NFL insiders” you are talking about because everything I ever read about or listen to regarding the Hunt family or even Pioli is glowing in their admiration of them. (Except most crap coming from the local media nowadays.)
Bonofied - January 27, 2012
I Think People Assume Hunt Is Actively Involved
I really don’t see that, though. If anything, his actions to me indicate a boss who gives his people a lot of leeway to do their jobs with a minimum of interference or guidance. You didn’t hear stories about Hunt micromanaging Peterson’s decisions and you don’t hear things about him doing it with Pioli. In fact, Pioli’s contract stipulated that he got complete control over football operations.
Hunt just seems to judge people on the end result. If you want to spend, spend. If you want to be cheap, be cheap. But if you don’t get results, you’re gone. I don’t think there’s much evidence that Hunt is being cheap, though. Part of the reason they maintained so much salary cap space was that they had to re-sign so many guys the last two years and didn’t want to hamstring themselves. They’ve burned quite a bit of that space this last year.
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
This is a bunch of childish BS.
Get over it, pay the man and move on. It isn’t going to do anything but hurt the image of the Chiefs even if baby hunt feels butt hurt.
Budd Jones - January 26, 2012
What if he doesn't deserve to be paid?
bossmanham - January 27, 2012 via mobile
He deserves to be paid.
This is all crap he had the Chiefs in line to be in first place all year despite all the set backs. That is his job as coach. Anything this is about is shit from management. He may have been a stubborn ass but he did the job his was given. If they didn’t like it he should have been fired before the contract they agreed to.
Budd Jones - January 27, 2012
for this year.
Budd Jones - January 27, 2012
Teams don't just not pay coaches.
bossmanham - January 27, 2012
Doesn't Matter
There’s a reason nobody except Al Davis gets into these pissing contests in the NFL…because when you treat staff like that, good coaches don’t want to come work for you. Aside from Jon Gruden, who got some extremely unconventional concessions written into his contract, the Raiders have largely had to make do with scraps for the last 20 years. That’s why even utterly incompetent coaches who half-assed their final seasons still get their contracts paid by every other team.
And let’s look at the big picture here. The previous head coach and several current and past employees either accused or at least suspected the team of bugging their phones. The GM has fired all but three people he inherited and is reportedly screaming at people about candy wrappers in the hallway. This is not a place that up and coming young coordinators and assisants are looking at and saying “Oh yeah, that’s where I want to go and build my career.”
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
Karen Kornacki is probably curious
why they would do such a thing so close to Valentine’s Day
ExRoyalsFan - January 26, 2012
Rec'd!
Tarkus - January 27, 2012
Best post in this horrible thread. (w/respect to my AP brethren)
Seriously broke my scowl and made me laugh. Thanks.
Justin Bopp - January 27, 2012
And Just Because I Don't Want It To Be Forgotten
The Todd Haley Rat Salad Incident
http://www.dallasobserver.com/2006-11-23/restaurants/i-smell-a-mcrat/
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
Those are the worst pictures of Mike Shanahan yet
ExRoyalsFan - January 27, 2012
Sued For $1.7 Million
I have a general philosophy that the kind of people who sue fast food companies for large sums of cash for things that don’t involve actual injury, illness or fatality are usually unstable in their overall lives and should be avoided like the plague. Especially people who sue over “mental trauma” (or whatever).
UCrawford - January 27, 2012
Part of me wants to not care about this story
and other stories that make the organization shine in a negative light. But, I have always been proud to be a Chiefs fan because I always thought the players, coaches, and front office were classy people that didn’t make the news for things like this. I’d expect this sort of garbage out of the Raiders, but not the Chiefs. I really hope this stuff isn’t true and that the players, coaches, and fans can move on gracefully and concentrate on a great off-season where we make this team a whole lot better.
5280ChiefsFan - January 27, 2012
This is embarrasing.
A contract has nothing to do with like or dislike in a sports game.
Regardless of what you think about Haley, this is terrible for trying to get new coaching and playing talent into the organization unless the front office gets in front of this quick and states that they plan on paying what the contract guarantees in this situation.
MichaelMantastic - January 27, 2012
"Fired for cause"
That, folks, is reason in corporate America to NOT pay someone. If you are fired for cause, you do not qualify for severance or unemployment pay. You can take it to an arbiter, and plead your case.
Your move, Mr. Todd Haley.
I await your action.
neiowakcfan - January 27, 2012
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